Hello and welcome to Cooking Issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of Cooking Issues Coming Dee Live from Laurel Canyon. What is this? Somewhere somewhere in LA, right? Laurel Canyon?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh not in the studio. We're in an Airbnb. It's a nice Airbnb. I'm in the room with Nastasi the Hammer Lopez, Jackie Molecules.
And Harold McGee. Got Harold McGee. How are you doing, Harold? I'm doing great. Thank you.
Yeah, yeah. And uh do we have John uh in uh Joe? No, John. But we have Joe in the booth in the New York booth. John, how you doing, John?
Yeah, yeah. Key Chi. Have been here with just Joe. I love you, Joe. Yeah, just John.
It's nice being here with just Joe, you know. I know. You gotta, you know, have a little uh you have a little just you bonding time, you know? It's nice. Exactly, exactly.
Yeah. Perfect. Lovely. Uh and I think we were gonna have Quinn's, I don't know. We'll see if Quinn uh gets back on.
Uh and we'll wait. We have the announcement for my man Quinn. But I want everyone to know, I mean, very few people are gonna hear this before Friday because it's just our Patreon people, but that's actually the last day to buy a new Spin Zall 2.0 for the pre-order. Like ever. I mean, like, so we honestly don't know when the next time you'll be able to buy one is because I don't know.
We're like, you know, that way we're not solvent that way. Uh anyway, um, all right, so I'm not used to having like mm you know the majority of the people in the in the room with me. So uh what uh hey John, you're you're over there. What's uh what's gone on in the past uh week in the world of food. I have just finally fully recovered from being sick.
I've been out of work for three weeks. I had strep throat, and then I had COVID. Wow. And I gave my mom COVID too. So I was yeah, it's been I've been in full form.
Today's gonna be the first day back. Yeah, yeah, hold up, hold up, but so you went from the throat then to the lungs. Different infection. So, like, what's next? You're gonna get some horrible GI bug?
You gonna work your way down? Hopefully nothing. Why are you saying that? I'm just asking. I don't know, man.
I'm just I'm just just asking. Uh all right. So uh but so like just recently, so you like not even time to have any interesting food, fun food facts. How's the restaurant faring with you being all all sick? Everyone's a little overworked, but I think it's been going well.
Yeah, because it's you know new era. They can't get mad at you. Yeah, they can't get mad at you anymore, and that's new era. I know. It used to be like doesn't matter how sick you are coming in work, and now exactly.
It's so much better that it's not like that. Right. Except, yes, it's it's it is better for the world that it is like that, but in general, you know, if it wasn't bad for the world, you'd rather be working than at home recuperating, especially like in that weird time when you don't feel sick anymore, but you still can't do anything with people. You know what I mean? Absolutely.
That's yeah, it's a real it's a real burn that one. But anyway, yes, it is it is better. Um, and what about you guys in the room? Anything, I mean, obviously, we had a we made a meal last night. It was like, you know, we didn't ruin anything here.
We're in someone's Airbnb. Let me ask you a question, John. Um let's say, I mean, I don't I'll just say it, see what you think. They put a cheese knife, you know I don't see very well in the dark, right? Yeah.
You know I don't see very well in the dark. So I'm out there in the dark. I'm I think it's reasonable to assume that if you pick up a cheese knife to cut a piece of cheese, that the handle of that knife isn't gonna be so sharp sharp that it slices slices through your like relatively well-callused thumb. You know what I'm saying? Yeah.
That's reasonable, right? Yeah. Like, if any of you folk out there have an Airbnb and you're like, the handle of this cheese knife broke, maybe I'll glue it together in such a fashion, it's a glass handle. Did you keep it, Dave? I don't know what I did.
It's still out there. Oh, good. Okay, because I'll take a photo and maybe we can get it. Oh, come on, I'm not gonna try to get any money out of someone for slicing my thumb because it's just a bonehead move. It doesn't mean they have to be financially.
We can save Kempari more money. Well, maybe we can just see what we can try to find out what cheese knife that is. Yeah, and then well, and then I'll get this, John. And you know, like I sometimes go, I sometimes go, I don't know, aggressive when something's not, you know, whatever. So they had another cheese knife that was like intensely dull, right?
But that was the cheese knife that I was gonna try to cut this other cheese with. Meanwhile, I'm bleeding. P.S. You know what I mean? I still want cheese, because just because I'm bleeding doesn't mean that I don't want cheese.
You know, and I've bald up my hand with my thumb tucked under so that I'm not, you know, dripping blood on people's food and and and whatnot. I pick up the next cheese knife. It's some sort of like, you know, aged gouda, Borinkas equivalent, whatever in the hell they have out here, you know. I don't know what they call it when they import it out here, you know. You know, I'm an East Coast man.
And uh the knife just shatters in two. I push into the cheese, and the knife just freaking like blows up like the pieces of the knife everywhere. And again, I'm not using it to pry open a paint can. Like if you're prying open a paint can and a little tip of that knife goes in your eye, that's on you. You know what I mean?
You should have gotten a pry bar or you know it's happened to me. Yeah, right? Of course it has. We've all done it. The worst, oh my god, how many of you have done how many of you use Ulfa snap knives?
I use Ulfa snap knives a lot because they they're thin, they you can carry them in your pocket, they look like pens, you know what I mean? But sharp knife. But you're always like, I need to pry that open. Don't use a snap knife to pry things open. Yep, yep.
Yeah. Also, like that the miniature Ulfa snap knife, the one that's the same size as a small X-acto blade, has this issue where it never wants to snap along the snap lines. So, like the bigger Ulfa knives, like they snap real easy. You put them against a table, you go, you hold your hand over it, you go pop, and the blade stays on the thing. But the the super sharp exacto equivalent one always wants to break at some crazy angle.
I still like it though. The holster for them, the actual thing is stainless steel. So it's impossible to get it so enfiled that you can't un-in-filtern it. You know what I mean? Yeah.
Uh all right. So let me see. Uh someone let me know if we uh if we ever uh get uh Quinn on the line because he was on the he was he was on the line yesterday, so I don't know. Maybe maybe he thought that because we were in LA, we were moving it up to noon LA time. He was gonna get himself a break.
You think that could be it? I'm gonna tell you soon. Alright. So later today we're doing a class at Thunderbolt LA with uh Mike Happiferi, and we're gonna be talking Spinsall 2.0 and all of the magical, awesome things that it can do. And then tomorrow, if you're hearing our voices, there is still time to come to the Thunderbolt Booker and Dax uh party.
But if you bring an apple head doll, you will get a creamsicle. Well, is it more road sign stars or more creamsicle? It's like those guys, the the prison workers that work on the side of the road color. Wow. Yeah.
So you assume that everyone who's on the side of a road with a jacket is in prison. That's what my mom told me. Well, your mom is not correct. That's just not right. Like, that's like a job that you just get.
Yeah. Cleaning the side of the road? Yeah, we we don't like first of all, like not every state is like a chain gang state. I think maybe California is. I mean, man, it's just like So that's the color of this hat, ladies and gentlemen.
So if you want to be seen as a chain gang chain gang orange. It's a little brighter than it's a little, it's got a little more of a highlighter tone than like uh than orange jumpsuit orange, I think. We were saying last night it's so low fashion that it's actually high fashion. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
And uh we if you come and bring an apple head doll, uh, we recommend that you leave the plastic crinkly thing in the hat in the hat. Cause first of all, you get this. Wow. Yeah. And secondly, it makes it stand like r real real straight.
I don't think you should do like Nastasia did and adjust it five sizes too small and squeeze it over my head, because then you do get a severe headache. Yeah. You're also gonna sign them, right? If you want me to. And then uh, and then uh I I'm not listening I've told you guys I'm not a fan of snapback in general, but I guess in a hat this low five, yeah, like snapback.
We can only afford those. Here's what I like. Like a standard snapback is a single large snap, right? On the on the thing. These guys are like, I don't really trust the one snap because it's gonna be so low quality.
Just throw in two and that's cheaper. Oh yeah, two rows of snap. Two rows of snap. Double enforced snap on this. Yeah, yeah.
So, you know, I don't know, man. Hope we're painting a good visual for the listeners here. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, you need one of these hats, man.
Yeah. Uh oh, we're barrel talking. It's got at least 65% cotton, but I'm sure it's uh post-consumer cotton. So uh we're good. All right.
Uh so uh Quinn said, oh Quinn can't be online right now. Uh Quinn said to do the Harold McGee questions first, but unfortunately I don't know of the Harold McGee questions first because I don't have the new questions. So I don't know what to do about this. So Harold, welcome. Have you ever when was the last time you were on the show?
It's been uh a long time, right? Oh gosh, I um yeah, maybe back when my book came out. Wow two thousand twenty. Yeah. When the new book came out.
That's like three years ago though. Nosedive. Yeah. Almost three. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, his his his Instagram now has to have the word smells in it.
Yeah. It's like on food and smells. What is it? On food and smells? Uh on food.on smells.
On food dot on smells. Yeah, yeah, yeah. On food. How about on smells on food? That would be that's the news.
I clearly didn't spend enough time playing with the possibilities. Yeah, yeah. No, but I mean, like you could do like a have you considered doing a double volume set where they're like the same and it's like on food, and then you could like, you know. I mean, nosedive has a different, you can't really package them together because they have an entirely different format. It's an entirely different shtick.
It's not a continuation of the other in Smellland. Yeah, yeah. Well, and I was told by my publisher of on food and cooking that it can't be any longer than that. And so that would mean kind of doubling the length. Yeah.
Maybe there are ways to get around that now. I don't know. I don't know. Uh all right. Well then uh I'm just gonna start reading some questions, and maybe they're for Harold, and maybe they're not, right?
We'll see. Uh from now how do you think you pronounce this? L butts? L butts. L butts.
But I don't know. B-U-T-T-E-S. I'm gonna go with El Butz. Yeah, I like that. Yeah.
What do you think? Yeah, let's go. Yeah, I mean that's what I would want to be called. Although, like, oh, it could be El Booties. That would be good.
Both work. Or maybe it's Butte. Could be Butte. Yeah, I think it's Butte. El Butte.
El Butte. That's good. You know, I've never I've been to things they call buttes, but I've never been to like a serious, like tabletop, like close encounters. Harold, that seems like something you've done. You've been you ever been to one of those things?
I have not. Because how do you get on top of one of those things if you're not like a climber? Helicopter? There you go. No idea.
You know what? I just I feel like we're never gonna get there, Stas. At one point we were like, what do we gotta do to get helicopter rich? Who what do we who do what do we have? What terrible thing do we have to do to get helicopter rich?
That's not billions, though. To have a helicopter? I mean, helicopters are expensive to maintain. You know? I don't know.
We're beyond even getting a helicopter share. We're beyond like having enough money to like get a blade to go to yeah, yeah. Anyway, uh L. Butes wants to know. Keep hearing about Dave's dislike of melon.
Makes me wonder about Midori and as to whether Midori is that green fake melon liqueur, which I just tasted again. And yeah, it's bad. I mean, it's fine though. You know what I mean? Like, so like a like most liqueurs like that to me are like some flavor and then like a lot of sugar and some color.
So, you know, it's fine. Like, I don't find it as offensive as a real melon because it doesn't taste like a real melon. You know what I mean? And as I've said many times, the more something tastes like a melon, the more I dislike it. You know what I mean?
So uh anyway. Uh wonder about Midori and whether that is considered contraband or not. Hey man, no, listen, I've had people pour me decent Midori drink. Look, a drink is a drink. Ingredients are things within that drink.
I learned a long time ago that small amounts of things I hate make things taste better sometimes. You know what I mean? Uh another question related to melons, but different. Is there any way to preserve the freshness of watermelon juice? Fresh watermelon juice is the elixir of the gods, but if it sits for even like five minutes, it just loses all its appeal.
Is there a way to keep it fresh or is it just a juice a la minute situation? Thanks. Do you know anything about Harold about watermelon juice and its and its uh lifespan? I've never worked a lot with it because it's I mean, I've made it, but I've never worked a lot with it. No.
And and that melon doesn't count among your um proscribed. Ah, okay. Okay. Yeah. I think the problem is that the the main volatile component in watermelon flavor is um something that is created when the cells are crushed and then just kind of either evaporates or reacts with other stuff.
So it just it doesn't last. So like melt watermelon jolly ranchers into the juice. Yeah, yeah. Jack up that particular molecule, yeah. Yeah, that's my favorite melon product is yeah, watermelon jolly ranchers.
Um I gave this, so like I I see what you think about this. Maybe it's the some of these volatile things and the other melons that I hate, because I've had dried melon that I think is good. And it and by the way, I know a lot of people melons a texture problem. It's not a texture problem for me. So like, could it be something there?
Like it's just that muskiness that I hate. Yeah, so the honeydews which m but they don't have as much of the m the musk melon aromas the cantaloupe is fake situation. Are you part of this internet wave? Uh no. That like our cantaloupes aren't actual cantaloupes and that cantaloupes aren't available here and that the cantaloupe that we have is not a real cantaloupe.
It's some sort of new variety that's only like like 70 years old or something like this. Well, on this train. Yeah, d uh my understanding uh is that uh cantaloupe melons come from a place in Italy by that name, Cantalupo or something like that. And uh and it's like a hundred years old, 150 years old. And of course, there have been different varieties developed from it, different versions of it, and some of them maybe bear little or no resemblance to the original, but so even the original is only like a hundred years old.
That's my recollection. And the one that comes from California that we see in the supermarkets with a uniform netting on the outside and bright orange flesh and that horrible cantaloupe taste. That is even younger, but as from here, and it's not the same as they No, they're they're continuously breeding them so that they'll do better in you know California agricultural conditions, which are not the same as uh central Italy. So are you a fan of cantaloupes? I love a good one, yeah.
A ripe one. So the better more it tastes like stuff I hate, the more you like it. Exactly. All right, from uh Skull Van. Uh short version of question.
I'm wondering if Dave can share any more details about whole limes being juiced in the Kovings juicer. So the Coovings, the Augur juicer that I use. You ever done have I've done I haven't done have you ever done these experiments, Harold, with full peel juice? No. No.
So you are you okay, uh briefly. Briefly. So uh you know the superjuice phenomenon that people like this whole superjuice megilla? Nope. No, all right.
So like so, you know, oleo saccharum? Yeah. Okay, okay. So in oleosacrum, everyone got all bent because they're like, oh, you know, the oil's not soluble. You're using the sugar as an abrasive.
Yep. All right. So we're agreeing on this. Yeah, sugar's an abrasive. You then add juice to it, and it's quote unquote more stable because so much peel is in it that you don't notice the um what's going on to the juice, which is still aging.
You haven't actually made the juice last any longer. You just added more flavors to it. Yeah. So they do it instead of with sugar, they do it with acid. And then to make up for the fact that now it's super acidic, they jack in uh water.
So it's water, juice, and peel. And they like it. A lot of people say they like it better. For me, you know, yeah, I don't know, you're making it cheaper because you're adding water to it, right? It's not like acid adjusting a juice, it's like adding water and just like, you know, airzat's juice.
Yeah. Are you with me on this? Okay. So I was like, if if what you like is peel, what if you just throw the entire piece of fruit into like a vertical auger juicer? Then instead of grinding up the white part, like literally just presses the entire thing very, very hard, almost like you would if you were muddling peels with turns out it's delicious.
Lime is a little bit too bitter, so like you have to cut it 50-50. Uh, but like lemon is great, and you know, I wouldn't use it in every application, but and so like I don't know what to call it, so I call it peely juice. So uh Scullivant was saying about about peely juice. Uh, if I have any more information on it, I've only just played with it. I haven't tested like the range of drinks to use them in and what's better and what's worse.
I have stabilized it a little bit, like so. I've hit it with like a little bit of um uh arabic or acacia gum to like uh uh keep the oils like fully in suspension throughout it. Um I didn't want to thicken it too much with Xanthan. Some people have a problem because they I here's the where every juicer is different, like uh like you know, in Rosemary's Baby, every pregnancy is different. Every juicer is different, and so they're all the juices that every juicer makes is is completely different.
So like Breville throws it crap because it's centrifugal juice or throws a crap ton of because it shreds and then anything that it shreds, it throws through the centrifuge and so stuff gets through. So people were saying that when they were doing this kind of juice with a centrifugal juicer, which I don't know, I haven't tried it, but it doesn't sound like it's gonna be as good, that it actually the pectin regels overnight and they get like a gel. Um anyway, let's see what uh Sculvan did. Long version. Uh we uh they have uh at Skull Van Distillery, they picked up a Revo 830, which is the one I use, and they tossed limes into it.
Uh too oil heavy and bitter. So what they did is is they juiced the whole limes, they hit it with pectin X, they ran it through a centrifuge quickly to do some partial stripping uh of the of the pulp and some of the oil, and then they liked it a lot. They thought it was real good. But I do a lot of partial stripping actually. You know, you want to keep it whole, like you want to keep a lot of stuff in it, but you don't want it like if it's totally clear, it won't shake.
Uh-huh. Uh huh. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Uh all right. Anyway. Uh oh, and Skull Van, Quinn. I know you can't be online at now, but if you can uh hear uh Skull Van wishes you because it's Quinn's if Quinn's not gonna come on, we can just say now, right?
It's his 30th birthday tomorrow. Tomorrow. Happy birthday, Quinn. Yeah. So you know, we we happy birthday, Gwen.
Yeah. We hope for the day that he can come back on regular, that all of this stuff gets uh straightened out. He just uh sent a question over for Harold. All right, let's hear it. Uh when garlic bulbs are stored for a while, the germs inside the individual cloves of garlic often start sprouting a green shoot.
It's often said that it's best to remove the germs from the cloves to improve the flavor of the garlic. Is this a myth, or is there some reason the green shoots taste bad? If this is a thing, is it best to remove the germ of the clove even when it's not green, or is it only an issue when it's green and sprouting? So uh this idea that the that the the shoot in the middle of the uh garlic clove is a problem, I think goes back to classic French uh technique, because that's where I've seen it the most, and especially I know that Thomas Keller in his books is very particular about cutting that out before you then blanch the garlic five times in milk to remove all flavor. Exactly.
And and I think that's that's actually the the point I would make about the the uh the germ is that you know the relative unless the the clove is really um anemic, that uh center shoot is a tiny fraction of it, and I don't think it's gonna have much effect. I actually, you know, well if if I've got a clove that is kind of green in the middle, I'll I'll pull on it because it's really easy to pull it out and then munch on it while I'm chopping the rest. Delicious. Well, that's what you said to me years ago when I first I brought this up to you years ago, and you're like, you ever have like uh green garlic scapes? And I'm like, yeah.
He's like, do you like them? I'm like, yeah. He's like, there you go. You know what I mean? But on the other hand, though, when they what causes garlic on storage to go kind of like is it that it's been bruised and then like the the sugars break down when it gets kind of brown and shrinkly, then that's gross.
Yeah, yeah. And it gets really harsh. I mean, it's still garlicky, but harsh garlicky, not kind of fresh, juicy garlicky. How much do you pay attention to and I I know that we never got that guy block on with his garlic book? Uh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Eric Block, yeah. Yeah. Who wrote like the book on garlic, which is kind of like a mishmash of like hard s hard science, you know, with all of freaking sulfur chemistry and like Lauren recipes, right? Yeah. Not as not as good a read as your stuff at all this.
Anyway, uh I own the book though. And um it's a good book. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of good stuff.
So I mean everybody knows that. So this is something that worried me for a long time because everybody knows that like the way that the garlic is sliced and or crushed prior to being heated has a a large impact in the flavors and it uh that it develops, right? At least this is what I read and what I was told. And then it just got too much for me. I just I was like I I'm not gonna worry about this anymore.
I'm just gonna chop up the garlic. I'm not gonna worry about how mashed it is where where are you in this continuum of worrying about how you prep your garlic. I'm with you know if I'm cooking something I don't have time to worry about it. So you know if if I've got um if I have to hunt around to find a masher I'll forget about it and just use my knife and some salt and and bash it. Yeah the salt helps right it's a more abrasive situation.
Yeah. I hate my fingers getting sticky when I'm working with garlic. I hate it. It's a special kind of sticky that I don't like. I don't like any kind of sticky but yeah.
Uh I've also I'm not very good at the I'm not very good at the mash into a paste. I've seen like you know Anne Borrell's real good at it. She'll like mash like the garlic in like in one or two shots, and then she can just hack a rack a doodle to get rid of the filaments that still exist in the mash I'm just not I've never really uh yeah no I'm not I'm not adept enough to do that. So usually I'd I just use a grater. Oh yeah?
Yeah. I have one of these new like uh they're like mezzaluna style paste makers. Have you seen this? No. So it's like it's like looks like a cheese grater, but it's got a handle on it, and it's uh and you spill you you just put it on the on the on your board and you go and it just extrudes the garlic through the holes.
You know what it doesn't do? Clean itself easily. It sucker is so hard to clean. Do you remember back in the day when the the first aluminum xyless garlic presses came out and they were huge. Everyone was like, God, I'll buy a garlic press.
And then there was a huge backlash, and I don't feel there was ever a comeback. You know what I mean? Like I feel like the backlash was like, You're a bad cook, you need to use a garlic press, you're a bad cook. And then no one was like, why? You know, why?
Who cares? Yeah, but they also don't work as well as a grater, right? So that's even more cleaning. You use like a microplane or like a box grater. Yeah, no, microplane.
And and uh as long as you do it right away, I think they I just rinse, you know. You just you just whack it against the side of the sink and rinse and all the stuff comes out. Yeah. Really? Yes.
Yeah. We'd have to like use ginger or garlic or something like that. Yeah. Oh yeah. You go you grate your ginger too?
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Do you know uh I feel it like the microplane has taken over. I okay.
There was a rumor going out that like microplanes can actually make damaging fibers because they're so sharp that they don't crush stuff enough, and that like I don't believe that at all. Like for cinnamon or whatever, I don't believe it. I'm just gonna go ahead and say I don't believe that. But I will say that uh because of the you know intense microplane hegemony that's happened in the grating world in the past, you know, 15 years that we miss that other graders make different like graded things. So like the venerable crappy box grater with the punched out, you know, nail punched out stars.
I like certain kinds of cheeses like granas on that that grater better than the super fluffy stuff from a microplane. Yeah, yeah, you know? Yeah. Yeah, no, I agree. Um there's some new box graders too, with like you know, different different surfaces on the four sides and and sometimes the bottom as well.
So all kind of, yeah. Yeah. I don't know that there's a need for the big hoop box grader. Although I guess it's good for things like I mainly use my box grater for the the rough, the rough side, not the because I have other things that do the other kinds of gradings quite well. You know what I mean?
But uh Saladmaster, I'm a salad master man. You know what I mean? Hey, get this. Do you know how we worry a lot about safety for the for the spinz all because like that's our job is to worry about like the interlocks and all this? And how like everyone's like, well, do you know how easy it is to disable the interlock in a uh in a cuisine art?
So like my queesen art, I had a great Quison art. I like the Quison art that just has the blank lid top. Do you guys know I'm talking about? Doesn't have the shoot feeder, which never works for me, doesn't have any of that crap, just a blank lid top and a go button. And like uh I don't know, it it broke, and like so I got a new one, but my I those so I have to use the one with the with the click on top with the all the shoots and like five levels of interlog.
And of course it fails, it breaks, you know what I mean? And so I don't know, I don't want to buy a whole new thing, and they they all have slightly different ones, so you need to know the exact model, whatever. But it turns out that if you just like click the bowl in without the lid on it at all, and take a butter knife and shove it into that slot in the back, it's on. You know what I mean? Like you don't even have to push real hard.
It's just like boom, you know what I mean? There's no way our factory would let us get away with something like that. And I was so angry that we have to jump through these hoops, and here I am with a Quising art, just freaking running it. I can shove my whole face into the bowl and blend, you know, grade it off. No problem.
And yet we have to like, you know, whatever. It's brand privilege, you know. It is. You know, well, you know what? It's funny.
Uh the if the factory in in their initial conversations with the certification labs, if they say, if the person's like this is a problem, then it's a problem. Like, and you don't get to say it's not. So it really is, like, you know, but if someone like Queas Nard says it's like, well, take it take it to a different take it somewhere else. You know what I mean? But like, you know, they're not gonna do that for you, you know, and neither do you have the money or time to deal with that.
Uh all right, do it. Do we have any more uh of those McGee questions? All right, got it. All right. Uh hey, Alex, you asked me about uh God and asked me of a question about a carbonated thing, but I can't see it because I'm I'm going.
It's so weird, like I have all this technology in front of it, but yet none of it is working for me. So I I'll try to look at that for for next week. Uh here's one. Uh Harold, you think about knives? Biffed it uh wrote in, I've often noticed that knives out of the box are always wickedly sharp in terms of cutting food items like onions and ripe tomatoes, but they will not cut the hair on my arm, like the shaving test, the good old-fashioned shaving test.
Although, yeah, what explains this and uh why can that kind of sharpness never again be replicated? Presumably, I can uh be much more precise and uh and use a uh higher grit than the factory finishing process. I mean, what do you do you think a lot about sharp? How do you sharpen your knives? Uh seldom.
Well, I'm sure your knives are sharper than the ones we used last night. Yeah, yes. Yeah, yes, yeah. Uh yeah, no, I I don't I don't do it that often. Um I've got you know one of the easy pull through things things.
Oh, I hate those things, so they ruin your knives. Yeah, yeah. But you know, I I share the kitchen with someone else, and um it's just the easiest solution. That is the truth. When you share your kitchen with someone who doesn't care, like it's hard to care about anything.
You know, you can't unless you have stuff that's like very like this is my stuff, which is what I kind of do with some of my stuff in my kitchen. I'm like, this is my stuff. You don't, and Booker's like, why? I'm like, be like, it's my stuff. You know, I don't go and play with your subway memorabilia or use it to like I don't I don't fry an egg on your roll sign.
You know, don't use this. You know what I'm saying? Um, anyway. Uh I think you know, look, though a lot has been done in the past 15 years on knife sharpening. And uh, you know, a couple of years ago we had on uh the knife steel nerds uh guy Laron Thomas, right?
Um and uh so it used to be that there was a lot of guesswork about how sharpening worked, and people would be like, micro serration this, boobity beep bop that, and you know uh he kind of in his book, and a lot of other people have done this, just they just take scanning electron micrographs of what's going on and actually look and then you know just run scads of actual real world tests on the force required for cutting through various things, and people have devised all sorts of like uh how many feet of paper can uh a blade cut through before the paper tears, and they have an automatic pulling machine that does it. So all like all of this stuff has gone from like kind of just uh you know uh mystery and magic to uh you know real, you know what I mean? So you can just go look it up. I don't happen to know the answer off the top of my head, but you can get things pretty dang sharp, especially nowadays. It's easier to get things um arm something can be extremely sharp for something like a tomato and still have a relatively large angle in uh inclusion angle on on the on the on the blade, and but not really be good enough or be you know uh the best for shaving because those are very, very, very whether you want to call it a low angle or a high angle, but you know what I mean, very narrow angle.
Yeah, uh and so I would say that um you know there always used to be and still is a huge trade-off between how small of an angle you can get and how tough the uh blade is against you know chipping. Um we were just talking about chipping. I hate seeing a chip knife, but you know, all of my ceramics are chipped. Wiley, my brother-in-law, Wiley Dufresne, uh, as soon as the ceramic knife chips, he'll throw it away. He can't stand it.
So he buys a lot of those like cheap Kesera like ceramics, and then as soon as they're chipped, they're gone. But I'm like, I'm not gonna throw it away, right? Do you guys throw away a chip? No. Nope.
Nope. Do you ever get huge scallop chips out of the main belly of the blade? I do. The little pair, the little the pedties. Yeah, I still keep it.
I break the tip off. Like it has to be like totally hosed when you throw it away. But anyway, um, they're much better now uh at keeping those narrow angles. So if you want to uh shave with it, I'd say um, unless you're super dupe's good, you're gonna want a small inclusion angle. I mean, having shaved with a straight razor for many years and sharpening that thing, they're actually quite easy to sharpen, but I don't recommend it.
Like modern razors are so good that like, you know, I remember for years I was like, I had the brush, I had the cup. I was in my 20s. You know what I mean? So like I had the brush, I had the cup, I'm like, this is what I'm gonna do now. I'm gonna be, I have the strop, and like, and I would cut my face every day.
My face would always have like those lines, those cuts in it, and like I would get like, you know, I'm I'm a delicate flower, so my my skin is relatively sensitive, so like I would get all rip up, you know what I mean? And then I went back and I was like, I was like, you know what? I don't have my stuff with me. I'm just gonna go get a Mach 3 again or whatever the current is. I was like, damn.
Damn. This razor is awesome. And then I was like, why am I doing this? Straight razor, what am I? Oldie timey Dave?
You know what I mean? It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. There's no reason. I mean, like, uh, you know, if you're gonna carry it around to like Sweeney Todd people or something, I mean, that's that's a whole separate, the whole separate, yeah.
Get this. My wife, okay. So a couple of like a couple of months ago, we don't go out much. We're busy, right? You know what I mean?
So she's like, we live in New York. What the hell? Let's go see a Broadway play. So we went to go see parade. All right, fine.
Pred. Right. Uh performance was good, you know, whatever you think about the musicals, whatever you think about the musical. And she's like, we should go to Broadly More. I'm like, Yeah, that's that's fun.
We should eat beforehand, because crap on that, like trying to find some crap on that. You know what I mean? But anyway, so then she now starts going to Broadway with other people, not me. So she says, let's go to Broadway. And then she's like, Oh, she I forget where she just went, somewhere nice, somewhere fun.
And now she's taking uh as a birthday present to my niece, taking just her, not me, Sweeney Todd on Friday. And Sweeney Todd, great musical. I I walk around saying how like, you know, never forgotten and never forgave. I'm I'm I'm all about that Sweeney, though. You know what I mean?
Um just show up. That's what Nastasi would do, right? Just go. Just show up. Just buy a ticket and show up and be like, what?
I'm here. Because she wants to have this time with the niece. What she doesn't have to see you. That's weird. That's so that's so that's so aggressive.
I think you're just gonna put an angry look on your face. Do you get a better seat or a worse seat? But also, why why don't you do anything? Like you can't, you're like, I need the first flight out of LA. Like as soon as we're done.
Because now she's going to weight of things that I hack I'm not getting done. And there's literally not enough time for me to get the stuff that I'm contractually obligated to do done. Plus, the dog's gonna piss all over the floor and like all this other stuff. So I just I can't get, I can't, the sack is too small to fit the crap I have to shove into it. So, like, you know, anything that is like remotely like, oh, I would just like to do that, has to wait until I'm either dead or I actually get some of these projects done.
You know what I mean? How about this, Daz? You can take my ashes to all the fun places I'd like to go. And uh, you know what I mean? Like front row, swoony Todd.
Yeah. So that's the question. So does Nastasia buy like front row and look back and give the stare? Or does she go in the in the super news nosebleeds, and then someone's like, who's that person with binoculars? Oh my god, it's Nastasia.
No, she's in the balcony like Statler and Waldorf in the Muppets, you know. Yeah, she's up there on the wing. Love it. Uh from KM, I made corn milk. No, it's not this Monday, it's last Monday.
I made corn milk on Monday. It's tasty, which of course KM means that you hate it. Has taste. It's not a taste you like, but it is a taste. In in my kitchen, tasty counts.
Yeah. Tasty is your bro tasty. Yeah. Yeah. As you know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, we have we've had this discussion many times. But I can't get around it because I grew up with it. Yeah. You know, whenever we would go out and my stepfather would say something's tasty, I was like, oh, he hates that.
Yeah. Because he's not gonna say this sucks. He's just gonna be like, it has taste. Uh flavorful. That's a good one.
I've had many things that are flavorful. Yeah. A lot of flavor in that. All the wrong ones. And in the wrong proportions.
Yeah. But they're there. They are there. Uh I made corn milk on Monday, it's tasty. I estimated a seven-day shelf life.
Today it smells like sulfur, but the smell goes away once it's steamed and the taste is unaffected. Is there any way to eliminate the sulfur odor in the corn milk? And what uh I never think of corn as being overly sulfurous. What do you think is going on there? Well, uh, so corn, one of the reasons corn goes so well in a in a uh uh kind of clam bake situation is that it's got uh dimethyl sulfide, which is what you get off the ocean.
So you're kind of sitting there cooking corn along with other things and kind of amplifying that um that uh aroma of place. Um usually that's a good thing. Uh I don't know why it would be so prominent that it would uh be annoying, but it is a volatile molecule. So if you heat whatever it's coming from, like corn milk, then it's gonna go away. But is it one of those things that's made like more prevalent by crushing, or is it is it is it is it present or is a precursor present?
Uh that's a good question. I'm not sure. Uh I'm not sure what the origin chemistry is. Um I just know that in in the flavor literature, it is considered one of the most important volatiles to give the impression of corn. Corn.
Corn. Mmm, corn. Uh we had someone call in from Iowa, and you know, I don't even think about Iowa sweet corn. I think about you know, Iowa like a lot of corn, but like not corn that I'm eating directly. I'm eating it by eating a pig.
Right. You know what I mean? Or whatever. And he was like, Yeah, no, like our sweet corn that we buy there is freaking great. You know, well, I'm all about that Jersey corn, because I live near Jersey.
Jersey's gotta have something, right? They got they got tomato Long Island Man knows what I'm talking about. Like uh, you know, they got they gotta have something, corn and tomatoes. Yeah. Anyway.
Uh, but now I kind of want like that awesome, like right out of the field Iowa sweet corn. And I grew up in Illinois. Great corn in Illinois. Yeah, good sweet corn. Midwest, yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. And so cheap. Cheap. When I go back home, yeah.
When did the super sweets come out? Not the half sweets. The half sweets have been around for you know a century and a half or so. But the super sweets, how long have they been around? I think uh like the eighties, seventies and eighties is when they were developed, and then it took a while to get commercialized, but I think that's so the corn of your youth had to be picked that morning, cooked that night.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. For like a nickel an ear. I remember when I was I still remember this when I was three. That w we used to live in um uh what's it called, uh, where Stanford is uh Palo uh was it Palo um Palo Alto or something like that, right?
One of those towns right there. Yeah. And uh my parents grew corn so they could have corn. This is like 1972. They grew corn so that they could have the corn and they would go cut it and write it right away steam.
Like cut steam. Do you think it's still better as super sweet? It doesn't matter at all because they just doesn't convert back to starch. Yeah, it doesn't convert back. And I I actually find today's corn kind of cloying.
Uh too sweet. Yeah, yeah. Um so but it's hard to find anything else. So I have to admit that I haven't done a side-by-side with a traditional uh a traditional year. I think people really want corn to be sweet now, and then it's like the sweet is the base, and then they start worrying more about texture, right?
So like it used to be like can you get like an ear of corn that's sweet as an indicator of freshness and like texture was a secondary concern because they were so concerned about getting the sweetness, but now we're more on texture. What do you think? Yeah, I don't know. I I like corn for its corniness. You know, I don't uh it doesn't really bother me as long as it's really got a a lot of corn flavor.
So you don't mind if it's gummy? Or do you don't mind if it's not sweet? Gummy g uh yeah, I like I like m more mature ears because they have more flavor. And uh in fact when I go through the bin at the farmer's market, I I look for the biggest ones possible because they're the the most mature. I uh I always just feel the top.
Do you don't rip them open, do you? Are you that guy? Uh no. Yeah, no. Yeah.
Uh in the seventies we used to drown our corn in butter. It's butter, salt, pepper. So I grew up for years, butter, salt, and pepper, and then I just stopped one day. And is it just because we had s crappy corn in in supermarket corn in the seventies, or has butter gone out of fashion or do people still butter the hell out of their corn, you think? Uh I don't butter the hell out of it, but I love butter on my corn.
Yeah. That's something so we in our household there's you know, two plates with corn for Ellie, corn for me. Hers just goes straight into her mouth, and mine I put butter, salt, I I kind of salt row by row. Wow. Turning uh to get it right.
Yeah. So but but it's not swimming in butter. It's not it's it's the partnership. It's not uh yeah, butter all over. Yesterday Nastasia was telling me she comes from a rotating corn family.
She comes from a uh rotate the corn in the butter and that like looks like somebody sat in your butter. No, I told you no. I thought you say yes. I do. Oh, you come from a rotating corn family.
Unfortunately, where like you'll go to butter toast later and you go in the fridge and you can see the stick of butter has that like indent from somebody having rotated corn on it. Yeah, no. It's terrible. No, John, where are you on on uh and Joe? Where are you guys on the rotating corn spectrum?
Maybe we long did we lose them? I don't know. Or if we just talking to ourselves, maybe the worst. All right, all right. Well, if if we hear from them, they can they can go in.
But you know one of the reasons that I can't have butter that's been rotated, other than the fact that it's terrible. First of all, once the butter melts on the corn, it's never the same again once it congeals back into butter form. It's been debuttered. You know what I mean? It's now some sort of in-between product, right?
Yeah, but I kind of like it the next morning. It's salty, buttery, so on uh an English muffin. You wait, you use the corn butter on an English muffin? All right. What if you take leftover corn and then just look like use it like wipe use the English muffin as like a dish rag and wipe off your thing and then toast it?
Would that work? I'm not I don'm I'm not getting the picture right here. So I've eaten Yeah, you're taking the butter off the melted butter off of the thing that has been poisoned with salt and partially melted off of the thing. But I'm saying but it's also got uh corn flavor. All right, yeah.
I don't know. Yeah. I don't know. But I was no I was saying like it like you know how you have leftover corn and you throw it in the fridge and the next day you make corn salad. Uh-huh.
Right? Yeah. So like if you had that, then could you just take your English muffin in the morning, wipe the excess butter before you do the corn salad? Because you don't want the necessarily the in a cold salad, you don't want the butter. Yeah.
Wipe it onto the English muffin and toast it. You're good. Yeah, yeah. My problem is there's never leftover corn. Um you gotta overcook.
Uh not overcook, but you know, overproduce. Yeah. So uh another problem I have with butter that uh happened later in life is when I was in grad school, one of my uh the you know, my the people in the program with me, his name was uh Kaysong, uh, and he used to make these Tibetan butter sculptures. And so he but his Tibetan butter sculpture was he would make a giant thing of butter. Stas you'll hate this.
The butter was like the butter was like waist high, and then he would get naked and sit, like put hit put his junk and whatnot, and the butter sculpture was the mold of his junk and backside, and then like just that's a lot of butter anyway. You know what I mean? And so like whenever so like that image of that, when I see a saddle-shaped kind of butter situation, and I love K-Song, but I'm like, don't want that on my toast. I don't I don't want his butter sculpture on my toast. It's not where it belongs.
No, it's not where it belongs. Uh do we get those guys back? Do they have any? I asked, John, I'm waiting to hear. Any opinion on uh on on rotation of corn?
All right. Uh Scott Shockley. Um. Oh, wait, what? We have a oh.
I see that your latest content on Instagram is a graphic of Kiwis going into the centrifuge. I'm a semi-Kiwi freak. Hmm. The fruit, not the people. Yeah.
And not the bird. Right? It's kind of a ridiculous bird, right? Uh like a little ground. Like kiwi.
The fruit is named because it looks like the bird, right? Not because it's from New Zealand. Or is it also from New Zealand? I think it's yeah. I think the fruit is named after the national identity icons.
All the amazing stuff they have in New Zealand. Why the kiwi, you think? Like as the thing. Yeah. Why?
Yeah. Don't know. It's not a particularly magisterial bird. Right? You know what I mean?
It's like. Yeah, but uh what are the alternatives? They have some really amazing, like interesting trees, whole little like ecosystems with like really rare and cool stuff. You know what I mean? I don't know.
Yeah, yeah. But needs to be cute, right? Needs to be short, small. Why small? So you can actually carry one around with you?
Anyway. Uh I'm a semi-kiwi freak and uh and a tiki freak and a spinzall owner. That's good. All right. Uh do you know of any great kiwi drink recipes?
No. Uh in my experience, kiwi isn't great when it's cold. I like it cold out of the fridge. I used to go so crazy on kiwis, I would eat them until my until my uh lips and gum started bleeding. I once ate 820 out of a bag.
The way I eat kiwis is I chop off the very hard end or sometimes use it as a little bit of a handle, and then they just chew it. And I think it's the combination of the protease enzymes and the rough, hairy skin makes for like it's almost like you remember when they used to say that that Blistex and Carmex that they would put fiberglass into it to make you addicted? Not true, I don't think. Because it's not true. But that was what was running the that was, you know, I think pre-internet.
That's what everyone was saying. There's fiberglass in that. No, it's not. Anyways, but it's kind of that is the equivalent of that. You ever like work with fiberglass?
Yes. Horrible. So fireplace. Oh God. Yeah.
Nastasia used to like love fake fireplaces, like, love, like LERV, fake fireplaces. And like, yeah, they're made of fiberglass. And but those is like, so like working with that kind of fiberglass where it can like stab you at a moment's notice and get on your skin has a different kind of hazard than like working with the fluffy fiberglass or just the stuff because that stuff breaks off in small pieces and really gets in your skin. Like your toast. You know what I mean?
It's like you're ruined. Uh yeah, I hate working with fiberglass. I don't think I ever want to do that again. I don't I liked making not with batting, but with like actual fiberglass composites. Like I used to like working, like not working with it, but like the fact that you could make something so strong.
Like uh used to strike me, Jack, as a man who's done some fiberglass pre preg work in your life. No? Never? You never like made a surfboard or no. Yeah.
No. All my work's in audio. Yeah. Well, uh, like fiberglass over foam, you can make these incredibly light things that like you could throw off of a building. You know what I mean?
Like, well, once they break, they break real bad. But you know what I mean, up until the point that they break. They're like, and there's something very cool that you can make something that seems so produced and industrial yourself. But on the other hand, hey, get getting in my hand. I don't think I'll ever do it again.
Anyway. Plus, now I would use, I did Kevlar once. Kevlar sucks to cut. Like I made uh I made Kevlar, I've done Kevlar. I've never done graphite.
Graphite's the money. Everyone likes graphite. You like to look at graphite? You do even you like the look of graphite anastasia? Yeah.
There you go. Uh all right. Uh so do you have any great kiwi drink recipes? In my experience, Kiwi isn't good cold, but I used to think uh that about passion fruit and the Demerar dry float proves that wrong. P.S.
I put my fist in the air when Dave ate a cherry. I hope he I can, I can eat as many as I want now. I mean, not as many as I want because people stop me, they're like, don't get hosed again. I want Harold to undo his his crustacean stuff with the shots, but he and he doesn't want you don't want to do it, right? You just don't feel like it's necessary.
You feel like you've gone crustaceanless so long. I just don't get around to it. But I'm I'm about to change doctors. Maybe that's something I'll bring up in my uh punch list. Yeah.
So Scott says he has uh the phytophotodermatitis for limes, but he still juices them with gloves on, which you know, kudos. Guess one else to juice those limes for you, man. Yeah, yeah. You know, get someone else to do that. Uh all right.
Uh Minwah Tiger question on the use of nitrogen and nitrous oxide in bar drinks. I know nitrogen uh is used for coffee, and a lot of home nitro is actually nitrous. It's actually both. The problem is the terminology. I had this problem.
I was going over the thing, there is no standard terminology for nitrogen versus nitrous um oxide. I will say this. When I think that if you're gonna listen to a group of people, listen to the funny car people. When they say nitrous, they mean nitrous oxide. Ain't nobody in a car pumping nitrogen into their freaking fuel mixtures to like get a better, faster burn.
You know why? Because nitrogen is freaking a waste product that's in the air. They're trying to get rid of that. They're trying to get more oxidizer up in that, right? So when those people say nitro, that is nitrous.
And those guys have been saying nitro since well before any of us have been around. Because they've been using, I mean, I think forever, nitrous oxide, right? In in in those kind of cars. So I think they get to own the term. So I don't think we get to go back as you know, coffee people or drink people and be like, no, no, now nitro means nitrogen.
No, no, it doesn't. And also, we have a nitrogen bull crap called beer gas, right? So beer gas is nitrogen and CO2 for when you want to jack the pressure to force it through a lot of lines, but you don't want to uh jack the CO2 higher, right? Or if you want, or nitrogen like in a Guinness head foam, they need a good word for that like rolling head that you get in Guinness, because that's what people are doing using nitrogen for, right? Is to get that rolling head and a depressurized drink.
So there needs to be a better word for that. But I don't think you get to choose nitrous or nitro. I don't think you get to, that's not, you know. You think what was that uh nitro was also like uh one of the American gladiators? He was one of the original American gladiators.
Wow. Back, yeah. Yeah, back beep. Yeah. So you think nitro was all about that nitrogen?
No. No, no, you know that there's not one but two or three different American gladiator documentaries out right now? Which is why I popped into my head. Yeah. It like one wasn't enough.
And apparently they're vastly different and take vastly different approaches to what American Gladiators was. And I didn't know even anyone cared at all. I I went, I had to say I went to go see them. And New Haven. Wait, you went to go see American Gladiators?
Yeah. That's so awesome. Yeah. New Haven, like they came through and like we went to go see American Gladiators because it was kind of like a cool concept, like local knuckleheads. I was like, I'm gonna go see local knuckleheads, get the crap beat out of them.
And then I saw this documentary, I was like, oh no, it really was dangerous. They really were getting the crap beat out of them. Yeah, they had no idea what was going on. And like people were getting real aggro, and everyone was like super roided up, so like they were actually like being awesome. And then like uh it was right around the time when um I guess Bush was still president, right?
So they were right around the time when uh they were like, people, steroids, bad. And so they were like, they try to make them all do the P test, and they're like, how are we supposed to do this job if we're not roided up? You know what I mean? Like, like how am I supposed to look like this and do this? Like, what kind of fiction is this?
You know what I mean? Where like I I'm supposed to go get the crap knocked out of me every day, look like I'm super freaking jacked, right? I mean, have the recovery time, just not a roid-free proposition, right? You know what I mean? Whole concept dies, yeah, and so like as a nation, we can't be we we can't we have to be like, well, we support the gladiators, but we don't support the roids, so we have to.
You know what I mean? Like, like, why is it that we can't like we when we wanna do something bad, why can't we just be like, we're gonna accept this bad thing? Don't you think we'd be better as a culture if we were like, no, we are making this choice to do something bad so that we can have jacked gladiators go out there on a daily basis. You know what I'm saying? I don't know.
I feel we do this all the time. We do it all the time. Yeah. Anyway. Uh all right.
Uh Ben S, I didn't get oh, I didn't get a chance to look at uh your mini vacuum just distillation setup. Let me ask you this, Stas. I know you don't want to do this, so I know you don't want to, but like, do you think that now that all of these fools are using rotary evaporators all over the world that there is no a market? Yeah, okay, good thoughtful answer. I'm trying to tell that or like Dave, imagine when all the glass breaks and that's what I've never used glass.
I would never use glass. The whole point for me is like the the dream. Remember when we were going and we were building it but we never finished it, and the FCI wasn't supporting us, and we went and I got that piece of stainless steel made, and we tried vacuum forming in the kitchen. I bought a whole bunch of uh freaking uh polycarbonate and we threw it like so you're gonna vacuum form polycarbonate people. Polycarbonate has trapped water inside of it, so you need to dry your polycarbonate at a fairly low temperature, like right around the boiling point of water in an oven, low oven for a long time before you heat it up to forming temperature, because otherwise the water will poo and you'll get bubbles in your butt can you guess what person isn't patient enough to wait around for the polycarbonate to dry in an oven before they vacuum form?
Can you guess? Me. Yeah. And then remember we we tried to to like you know remember we had the vacuum and we sucked it all down and it was like all messed up anyway we never finished it but my dream is the rotary evaporator that you can set up quickly and then uh open up the window in your high rise throw it out onto the street and God willing you don't kill anybody you can take your elevator down 30 floors pick it up off of the ground and run it again like that that is a rotary evaporator. Uh so we're wait so we still have a couple seconds what do you got Harold anything wait words of wisdom people want some McGee words of wisdom what do you got no pressure words of wisdom um a breath of wisdom breath of wisdom yeah yeah uh okay well uh this no come see us tomorrow Harold Harold come see us tomorrow at uh Thunderbolt LA right uh and it's probably too late to come see us today at the what's it called at Thunderbolt for the Kampari compar thanks to the Kampari uh USA team.
Harold you want to leave them with a little bit about uh coffee coffee and like rejiggering your mental words and how words are important and how you describe things how about that? Sure. So uh we talked about this at Harvard a little bit uh there's been a kind of standard chart for uh figuring out the sweet spot for brewing um pour over coffee and three quarters of it has been uh kind of off limits you know it's got uh it's weak. It's bitter. It's not good.
There's a new chart out uh as of a couple of weeks ago. And uh all the all that negativity is gone. It's now um tea like instead of weak. And other other qualities that you can enjoy in coffee. So keep your eyes peeled for a new coffee chart.
Right. And stay away from uh normative words when you're describing flavors. Yeah. Yeah. Nastas, you'll be very mad about this.
I'll leave with this. Uh so weak and undeveloped weak and underdeveloped, which was one of the coffee things, which is like my business card. We can underdevelop. It's now you're not gonna you're gonna hate what it gotta be labeled. What?
Sweet. Yeah. Yeah. No one's fixing my business cards. They're gonna say, thanks for coming on.
Uh good to hang out with you guys in the real life again. Joe and John, we'll see you hopefully next week. Miss you guys. Quinn, hopefully also be back. Happy birthday to Quinn.
Happy birthday. Yes, happy birthday. Cooking issues.
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